Judges Can Require Witnesses To Remove Face Veil While Testifying -- US > Europe

[Morfin]

Common sense wins over political correctness and fear of offense.

Michigan Supreme Court: Judges can dictate witnesses' attire

Judges can decide whether witnesses must remove head or facial coverings during testimony in their courtrooms, the Michigan Supreme Court declared today. The administrative ruling gives judges discretion over the appearance of witnesses.

The state Supreme Court considered the rule change as a result of a 2006 case involving a Hamtramck woman who refused to remove her niqab, a customary head and face veil, in court.

Ginnah Muhammad, a Muslim woman, sued 31st District Judge Paul Paruk after she lost a small claims case because she refused to remove her niqab so the judge could see her face during testimony. The niqab covers all but the eyes. She was contesting a $2,750 repair bill from a car rental company after thieves broke into a vehicle she was using.

Paruk dismissed Muhammad’s case for her refusal. Muhammad later sued Paruk in federal court.

Paruk argued it was necessary to see witnesses' faces during testimony to determine their truthfulness. Supporters of Muhammad, including the American Civil Liberties Union, argued those with religious beliefs that require face coverings should be allowed to wear them in court.

A federal court eventually dismissed Muhammad's case. The State Supreme Court voted for the new rule 5-2. Link (http://www.freep.com/article/20090617/NEWS06/90617030/State%20court%20%20Judges%20can%20dictate%20witnes ses%20%20attire?GID=nbDK0CZddr2xuV+CtN+xv6QljZgQft j1AvnnsA53w3k%3D)

[Stax]

This is interesting, actually.

[redsox39]

Here is the real question...what is the Law in France, Germany, and the UK?

[Morfin]

To surrender, ask the U.S. for help, and then whine about the U.S.





Oh, you mean about the naqib. Sorry.

[fuldstændigamok]

Judges Can Require Witnesses To Remove Face Veil While Testifying -- US > Europe
Hijab is forbidden in every school and for every governemental job.
France > Europe/USA.

[Pox]

The Judge was the guy from My Cousin Vinnie

[redsox39]

Hijab is forbidden in every school and for every governemental job.
France > Europe/USA.

Of course

http://www.traditioninaction.org/bev/bevimages/bv074_RiotsParis.jpg

[fuldstændigamok]

Of course

http://www.traditioninaction.org/bev/bevimages/bv074_RiotsParis.jpg

I don't see a single hijab in this pic. I don't see a single connection with the actual thread subject either.

[redsox39]

I don't see a single hijab in this pic. I don't see a single connection with the actual thread subject either.

Those are all former Muslim ladies who are pissed because they couldn't wear hijab's and got sex changes so they could protest in public without them.

I am pretty sure, at least.

[mongo]

i bet there are a lot of people out there who just wish the bitch would have paid the $2700 for a new transmission.

[redsox39]

i bet there are a lot of people out there who just wish the bitch would have paid the $2700 for a new transmission.

Is it Fatwa time?

[fuldstændigamok]

On the subject, the parliament is starting to take in consideration the possibilty to pass a law that would make the burqa and the niqab simply forbidden on the French territory.

[redsox39]

On the subject, the parliament is starting to take in consideration the possibilty to pass a law that would make the burqa and the niqab simply forbidden on the French territory.

While I would THOUROUGHLY enjoy that ruling, that is probably going too far. Replace "Burqa and niqab" with "Football jersey" and...well, you don't want government deciding your clothing options.

But I would love it.

[BIG PIZZLE]

Because you are a dirty racist.

[Morfin]

On the subject, the parliament is starting to take in consideration the possibilty to pass a law that would make the burqa and the niqab simply forbidden on the French territory.


This is why the U.S. will always be > France.

[redsox39]

Because you are a dirty racist.

I happen to shower very frequently, thank you.

OH! And Instead of racist, I would like to be called, "not sexist". Thank you.

Now go back to covering up your women.

Also, I would love it because, can you imagine the riots in Paris this time? when there is actually something to be upset over? Holy Shit!

[fuldstændigamok]

While I would THOUROUGHLY enjoy that ruling, that is probably going too far. Replace "Burqa and niqab" with "Football jersey" and...well, you don't want government deciding your clothing options.

But I would love it.

I wouldn't.

This is why the U.S. will always be > France.

I agree with you on that (liberty of expression), although there is also a fundamental difference between the US and France on the subject dating back to the constitution. France is a laic country. While yesterday I wrote that it was forbidden to wear a veil, burqa, niqab in any public school and at any governmental jobs, I forgot to precise that it was also forbidden to wear a kippa, a turban, a catholic cross showing over your clothing or any religious signs whatsoever. And THAT is something I'm actually extremely happy about.
Whatever your religion (and you're all free to worship whoever the fuck you want), please, don't fucking push it in my face.
And for that, France>USA.

[Morfin]

How is any of that "pushing it in your face." That is exactly the problem: People taking offensive to things that do not really affect them at all. Someone wants to wear a turban, yarmulke, whatever.

It's interesting that you say that you agree about "liberty of expression," yet, support this.

[fuldstændigamok]

How is any of that "pushing it in your face." That is exactly the problem: People taking offensive to things that do not really affect them at all. Someone wants to wear a turban, yarmulke, whatever.

It's interesting that you say that you agree about "liberty of expression," yet, support this.

How is wearing a small cross, or a star of david, or a cresent and star, or a little darwin fish around your neck pushing it in your face? Would wearing dogtags be pushing the miltary in your face or wearing a badge be pushing police departments in your face?
They can, under their shirt, no problem. Or in their private life, as I said they can wear whatever they want.
But while working for the governement, they should treat everyone as equal and be treated also as equal while respecting the constitution.
Religion is a private matter, end of story. Seeing my president praying before every conseil des ministres will drive me (and the majority of French) crazy and would be totally unacceptable here, with good reasons.

[fuldstændigamok]

Do you get offended at rappers wearing crosses that spin?

I'm offended by rappers, period.

[Mustard]

I just don't see how a small piece of jewelry is pushing religion in someones face.

I mean there was a very black baseball player named David something... and he wore a Star of David necklace and one day a reported asked him if he was Jewish and he nope my name is David and I'm a fucking Star.

So the point is, people who wer them may not even be religious, they just make think it looks cool.
Thats just pure idiocy and a load of failboat when it comes to symbolism.