The maddness is upon us!

[Tar Heel]

Discuss any offseason stuff relating to NCAA basketball here.

GO HEELS!!! You know you fear us!

Also, I posted this in another thread that no one will probably eve read, so I decided to post it here... where no on e will probably ever read it...

Anyway, this is why duke sucks...


Their coach is a filthy rat bastard (see Exhibit A). They play the game of basketball like a bunch of fucking pussies. They flop all over the fucking floor trying to draw charges instead of trying to play quality defense. (See Exhibt B.)I n fact they do it so much that referees have actually officiating the game differently as to all ow that type of pussy shit more. Half the fucking time when they flop, they don't even get touched.

Also, the refs have slowly become subtly and overtly biased towards Duke. This can be seen in the differential of fouls called in almost any duke game. On top of racking up pussy fake fouls, they get tons of non fouls called the other way. It gets infuriating.

Also, their coach is a cheese eating rat bastard.

Everyone at DSPN constantly sucks them off. They talk about how great their players are, yet 90% of them fail in the NBA. Additionally, the amount of years spent in the dook program is directly and inversely relational to their success. The shorter amount of time they spend there, the better they do once they leave. That tells me that their coach has no concern for how they will achieve at the next level, only how they can win in college.

Dook players are dirty filthy hackers and Coach K probably tells them to do it. (See Exhibit 3) Then after the game where Gerald Henderson obviously breaks Hansbrough's nose on purpose, Coach K says things like, " Gerald was the real victim here." and " Hansbrough shouldn't have been in the game"

These are just a few reasons off the top of my head, but trust me, there are 100's more.

EDIT: Also, did I mention Coach K is a Rat? If not, Coach K is also a Cheese eating filthy Rat bastard.


Exhibit A:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v623/tarheel2k5/K-rat.jpg


Exhibit B:
fqPBJ_6y_5A

Exhibit C:
fYOgC2Qbqh4

[Stax]

UConn = Win

[iKnowJohnStamos]

I was just thinking about this and I'm actually kind of bummed Jennings broke away and is going to play in Europe. If it works out (and it almost certainly will) then the quality athletes playing a year of NCAA will drop. It was nice to be able to see Rose Beasley and Mayo play a little in college...I guess the best way to prevent it is if they just didn't fuck with the rule. But the bottom line is I would like to see everyone play a year in College.

[Tar Heel]

I love the 1 year in college rule. It definitely helps the Heels with recruiting. But, I do understand why some people dislike it.

[goldsoundz]

everyone's talking up purdue this season but i just don't see it happening. when all's said and done it'll be my spartans on top of the big ten.

acc-big ten challenge this year against n. carolina at ford field. should be a good one

[ADD]

I love the 1 year in college rule. It definitely helps the Heels with recruiting. But, I do understand why some people dislike it.

Because if you're NBA ready at 18, why waste a year in college if you're not committed? Go get paid now, son.

[iKnowJohnStamos]

Because if you're NBA ready at 18, why waste a year in college if you're not committed? Go get paid now, son.


I know, Wu told me that as well, but Lebron in college would have been my favorite thing ever.

[ADD]

And the Cavs worst nightmare

[Fletch]

But they could have had Darko!

[ADD]

Only Larry Brown and Joe Dumars were dumb enough to take that turd second over Melo

[blazerboy427]

Darko Milicic FTW!

[iKnowJohnStamos]

Only Larry Brown and Joe Dumars were dumb enough to take that turd second over Melo

Melo, AND, Wade...pfft.

[iKnowJohnStamos]

Outside the Lines just had a report on offering scholarships to kids who haven't even played a high school game to that point. One kid as young as a raising 8th grader committed to Kentucky. I had no idea that actually happened. What does everyone think about this? Is there a 'too young'?

[Penguin Rick]

Well, I think it only hinders the university. The student who commits can still get out of it and go somewhere he really wants to go to even after he 'commits'. But the college has to give him his full ride scholarship since they offered it to him at the first place.

And plus, if you're dominating at the middle school level, chances are it's because you're more mature and are more developed than the other kids, instead of an amazing talent.

[ADD]

Donovan FINALLY signs extension at Florida

University of Florida basketball coach Billy Donovan signed his six-year contract extension Friday, 16 months after he returned to Gainesville following a very brief stint with the Orlando Magic, as reported by the Associated Press.
The deal is worth more than $19.5M before incentives.

[Dragon]

Kenny George is done after partial amputation of his right foot. I think the tallest active player in D1 now is at UCF.

[ShitBreak]

When Baylor is picked to finish 2nd in the Big 12...you know shit's about to get REAL.

[ADD]

You mean hilarious

[ShitBreak]

REAL hilarious. That's totally what I meant.

Baylor is fucking good. It's crazy.

[ADD]

See what they can do when not killing each other and covering it up!

[ShitBreak]

Who knew!








...anyone who DID know is now dead.

[footsies]

Tar Heel - What's your take on NC State and Sydney?

[ADD]

Olson out at Arizona

University of Arizona coach Lute Olson is set to announce his resignation, according to a report by ESPN on Thursday.
The school failed to confirm the report. ESPN also reported associate coach Mike Dunlap would be named interim head coach.
Olson missed a practice Wednesday and an appearance at a local Rotary club for health-related reasons, the Arizona Daily Star reported.
Olson’s decision to walk away will end a 25-year tenure with the Wildcats, whom he built into one of the nation’s elite programs.

[Dragon]

Wow....sad news.....my coach was talking about him the other day and how he was ready to get back and is reinvigorated for the season and the group of kids they have out there.

[ADD]

Excellent coach and he really made Arizona a good program for a while. I will miss him. Glad he got a title.

[mbslugger89]

is the olson news official?

btw func

[ADD]

If by official you mean U of A has announced it, no. But Andy Katz, Vitale and ESPN are all over this. He's done.

[mongo]

i see the first espn/usatoday polls were announced.

http://sports-ak.espn.go.com/ncb/rankings

1. North Carolina (31) 0-0 775
2. Connecticut 0-0 707
3. Louisville 0-0 694
4. UCLA 0-0 650
5. Duke 0-0 578
6. Pittsburgh 0-0 576
7. Michigan State 0-0 572
8. Texas 0-0 538
9. Notre Dame 0-0 525
10. Purdue 0-0 465
11. Gonzaga 0-0 437
12. Memphis 0-0 425
13. Tennessee 0-0 408
14. Oklahoma 0-0 387
15. Arizona State 0-0 304
16. Miami (FL) 0-0 233
17. Marquette 0-0 219
18. Georgetown 0-0 175
19. Florida 0-0 161
20. Davidson 0-0 158
21. USC 0-0 153
21. Wisconsin 0-0 153
23. Kansas 0-0 130
24. Wake Forest 0-0 129
25. Villanova 0-0 122
Others Receiving Votes
UNLV 60, Saint Mary's 59, Ohio State 54, Baylor 47, Xavier 27, Syracuse 23, Texas A&M 19, LSU 19, Arizona 18, Virginia Tech 15, Brigham Young 13, West Virginia 10, Washington 8, Siena 8, Kentucky 7, Vanderbilt 7, Oklahoma State 4, Clemson 2, Washington State 1.

[Smuckers]

You see, I just started following ncaa basketball rankings a few years ago.

Is it normal that the defending NCAA champion would be ranked hardly in the top 25?

[nuclearjew]

Yeah, if all the playmakers from that team left school.

[Penguin Rick]

Memphis is still pretty damn high, even by losing Dorsey, CDR and Rose.

Calipari knows how to recruit.

[Smuckers]

ah ok that makes sense...i guess thats why theres hardly any repeat ncaa champs except florida a few years back because they made a pact to stay one more year (which was pretty cool

anyone want to predict what the ncaa final four will look like...can Davidson and Curry win the ncaa's this time?

[Smuckers]

Who had the top recruitng class for 2008-09?

[kevin6387]

I think UCLA had the number 1 class this year. I know Kansas had the number 2 class after getting Tyshawn Taylor from Marquette. Kansas might be ranked lower (where I think they should be ranked after losing every starter and 2 key reserves), but they will compete just fine. They have won 4 straight Big 12 championships/tourneys even when they started all freshmen and sophmores in 2005.

Calipari is a jackass. He is saying he has all these schools locked up for noncon games in the next 2-3 years so recruits will flock to him, yet he doesn't have half of them. He said he just got Kansas to agree to a neutral game in STL, when we haven't. He's just trying to lock down Xavier Henry who's stuck between Memphis and Kansas. If Kansas gets Henry, they are goin to be a scary scary team in 2009.

[Smuckers]

Not good for UNC fans...if this is old ignore it

Hansbrough sidelined indefinitely with shin injury
Chapel Hill, NC (Sports Network) - North Carolina senior forward Tyler Hansbrough, the reigning national player of the year, will be out indefinitely due to a stress reaction condition in his right shin.
Tar Heels head coach Roy Williams announced Thursday night that an MRI revealed the stress reaction and indicated there is no timetable for Hansbrough's return.
According to the school, Williams will not have a statement until Friday after he meets with the UNC medical staff and Hansbrough.
Hansbrough averaged 22.6 points and 10.2 rebounds last year, leading the Tar Heels to a school-record 36 victories.
Hansbrough has played in all 108 games over his first three seasons with the Tar Heels, who start their season November 15 against Pennsylvania. North Carolina has a remarkable 90-18 record in Hansbrough's games.
The Tar Heels were chosen as the No.1 ranked team on Thursday in the preseason coaches' poll. They were beaten by Kansas in the national semifinals of the NCAA Tournament last season.
Entering this season, Hansbrough is poised to become North Carolina's all-time leading scorer. He has 2,168, which is just behind Phil Ford's 2,290.

[GhettoSuave]

Now that the seasons started, Tennessee looked good last night.

[Dragon]

Crazy good dunks from last night.....http://www.cfnews13.com/MediaPlayer2/MediaPlayer.htm?video=ucfhoops_111620080435&cat=Sports&title=Knights%20Win%20Season%20Opener

[Dragon]

The rich get richer

Xavier Henry, the top-ranked player in the ESPNU 100, announced Tuesday morning he will join his brother at Memphis for the 2009-10 season.
"Ultimately playing with my brother and keeping the family together helped make my decision," said Henry of Putnam City High in Oklahoma City. "My parents are okay with it; we're together."

[ShitBreak]

Nothing like losing a Oklahoma boy....to Memphis.

W.

T.

F.

[ADD]

He wants to win

[Penguin Rick]

Calipari sure knows how to recruit.

[Smuckers]

lol...Frasor from UNC missed the layup.

[Pollo]

anyone catch the Davidson/Oklahoma slugfest tonight? Stephen Curry is such a fucking baller.

[Smuckers]

Curry is simply amazing =]

Hope he gets to the Final Four this season.

[Smuckers]

UNC's Tyler Zeller likely out for the season with a broken wrist.

[Gary_Busey]

So, I'm a Michigan fan and my girlfriend is a Duke fan. I wonder if she'll still blow me after Michigan upsets Duke tonight?

[Smuckers]

Are there no NCAA bball fans here?

[Pollo]

Are there no NCAA bball fans here?

sorry, but alert me when it's March and then we can get all giddy. plus, most top teams are facing teams they should easily squash right now ... so hardly anything to be excited for at this point.

[ninja33]

well, memphis got upset last night, and with all the preseason tournaments this week there should be some good basketball that should give an idea of who's capable of what. UNC, Notre Dame, and Texas are in Maui(and so is Indiana to get nice and embarrassed)...and that tournament in Orlando has a ton of tourney teams (mich st, gonzaga, georgetown). There are other tournaments where at the very least teams from major conferences will be playing each other.

And then theres two top 20 teams playing tonight in UConn and Wisconsin. Hey stax, fuck you!

[Pollo]

with some upsets this week, here's this week's rankings:

AP


North Carolina (72) 3-0 1,800
Connecticut 4-0 1,694
Louisville 2-0 1,646
Pittsburgh 4-0 1,423
Michigan State 2-0 1,402
Texas 2-0 1,355
Duke 6-0 1,330
Notre Dame 2-0 1,291
Gonzaga 2-0 1,222
Purdue 4-0 1,161
Oklahoma 4-0 1,094
Tennessee 3-0 1,005
UCLA 3-1 916
Arizona State 3-0 767
Marquette 3-0 735
Xavier 5-0 600
Florida 3-0 535
Memphis 4-1 500
Wake Forest 2-0 414
Villanova 3-0 356
Georgetown 2-0 349
Miami (FL) 2-1 272
Kansas 2-0 272
Davidson 3-1 238
Wisconsin 4-0 214

USA Today


North Carolina (31) 3-0 775
Connecticut 4-0 730
Louisville 2-0 697
Pittsburgh 4-0 635
Duke 6-0 625
Michigan State 2-0 615
Texas 2-0 576
Notre Dame 2-0 551
Purdue 4-0 516
Gonzaga 2-0 481
UCLA 3-1 437
Tennessee 3-0 434
Oklahoma 4-0 415
Arizona State 3-0 343
Marquette 3-0 284
Georgetown 2-0 251
Memphis 4-1 246
Florida 3-0 238
Wisconsin 4-0 171
Xavier 5-0 166
Miami (FL) 2-1 146
Villanova 3-0 143
Kansas 2-0 125
Wake Forest 2-0 123
Davidson 3-1 100

[Smuckers]

I think Chaminade can upset UNC tonight.

[Jericho]

What is your fucking deal, smuckers

[Smuckers]

Huh?

Hansbrough won't play v. Chaminade tonight.....can Chaminade stun the world and pull a Virginia?

BTW, Jericho, funny avatar. Who is that?

[Tar Heel]

I think Chaminade can upset UNC tonight.

Wow. Talk about stupid predictions. Chaminade only had 7 eligible players total. Of all the games UNC will play this year, this was the one game that they would never have lost. Chaminade never had a chance. The Heels could have played Chaminade 300 times and won every single time.

Dumbass.

[Smuckers]

That's probably what Virginia thought, too.

UNC SHOULD be rolling over a team like Chaminade...and every team is beatable on every given night...even UNC!

[ADD]

The NCAA has barred Kelvin Sampson from coaching an NCAA team for 5 years. They spared Indiana and have given them 3 years probation.

[Soup Nazi]

Maybe we should bar Smuckers from posting in the NCAAB thread for 5 years.

[ADD]

Maybe we should bar Smuckers from posting in the NCAAB thread for 5 years.

Signed

[Smuckers]

http://mail.google.com/mail/e/320

[Smuckers]

If Oregon can get off to a quack start tonight, they can give UNC a good game!

[ShitBreak]

Maybe we should bar Smuckers from posting for 5 years.

S.I.G.N.E.D.

[Smuckers]

But then no one would ever post in this thread. :rolleyes: :D

[ADD]

Shut up, fart face

[NOTKyle]

If Oregon can get off to a quack start tonight, they can give UNC a good game!

I've never seen a post better than this one on this forum.

RISE TO THE CHALLENGE

[Smuckers]

Anyone see the Texas/Notre Dame game? Amazing game!!!!!!

[mongo]

who do i have to suck off to get syracuse to upset the fucking jayhawks?

[Smuckers]

Im frustrated by the Kansas/'Cuse game.

I'm not an Orange fan...but go Syracuse!

[Smuckers]

Kansas hits everything. sigh.

[Smuckers]

holy shit! Syracuse ties it!

[Smuckers]

overtime go Syracuse! Syracuse tied it up with a 3 with 7 seconds left.

[mongo]

smuckers. fucking end the play by play.

[Smuckers]

Sorry. http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/images/cry.gif

Syracuse wins!

[Pollo]

Maybe we should bar Smuckers from posting in the NCAAB thread for 5 years.

can we add the NBA thread, too -- pretty please?!?

[Smuckers]

UNC played very good against the Ducks last night, despite Ellington and Hansbrough being a bit off. Danny Green is very good. Ducks were never in it.

The game vs. Notre Dame will be a great one and I can see Notre Dame upsetting UNC..but won't bet on it. ;)

[ADD]

It's the Ducks

[Smuckers]

I will never bet against UNC again!! Until they play Wake Forest, haha.

UNC did great against Dame!! They are clearly deserving of their #1 ranking!! Unless they get a major, season ending injury to Hansbrough, Green or Ellington...this team will win the NCAA title!! Hansbrough is a joy to watch, aint he. I really like him!

Dame had some nice plays, but in the end couldn't pull the win out. UNC was clearly better! UNC will face tough tests against MSU and Rutgers before the ACC competition...I can see this team having only 1-3 losses before they win the national title...this team is good!

[Pollo]

I can't believe you're not hyping Notre Dame more after the lovefest you showed Jimmy Clausen in the college football thread.

[Smuckers]

For some reason, I wish Hansbrough played volleyball. I would like to watch that.

[Pollo]

For some reason, I wish Hansbrough played volleyball. I would like to watch that.

WTF?!?

[Smuckers]

He can sky, and would probably be a great attacker. I would love to see him hit the balls. But looks like hes doing pretty good at his chosen sport. ;)

[JT]

Your posts are such a joy to read.

[ADD]

Banz?

[Penguin Rick]

The fact that he's got more rep than is just fucking embarassing and shows a downright lack of justice in this world.

[Pollo]

Banz?

dude, you're spoiling my christmas gift to Smuckers.

Your posts are such a joy to read.

it's almost like he's a clone of Crack. I know it this will be hard to believe, but it almost makes me wish RMD was still around.

[Smuckers]

The fact that he's got more rep than is just fucking embarassing and shows a downright lack of justice in this world.

I don't get it either!! http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/images/tongue.gif

[GhettoSuave]

Tennessee putting up 90 on Georgetown was sexy. Most scored on them in over a year is what Ive been told...

[Rover]

it's almost like he's a clone of Crack. I know it this will be hard to believe, but it almost makes me wish RMD was still around.At least RMD could make a logical point. His Kobe hatred was extreme, but I never really minded RMD. Discussing how awesome Hansbrough would be at volleyball because "he can sky" is retarded. I bet Hansbrough is really awesome at reaching things on the top shelf, too.

I do wonder if Hansbrough's game will translate to the NBA.

[Pollo]

IMO, I think he'll be a decent player, but not a superstar player given how tough PFs are in the NBA and I don't think he exhibits that type of defensive intensity most PFs in the NBA possess. as of now, he doesn't project to be a lottery pick, and some scouts have compared his game to wait for it ... Eduardo Najera and Mark Madsen. now I cannot think he'll be a player like those two, but his lack of size for the 4 position in addition to lack of athleticism to play against NBA PFs will hurt his draft value. having said all that, I thought Kevin Love wouldn't be a top 10 pick (having some of the same flaws against him), but he ended up getting picked high, so it's too early to tell.

here's some of flaws scouts see in Hansbrough's game:

One of Hansbrough's most glaring weaknesses is that he isnt a superior athlete He doesn't show much vertical explosiveness and lacks super quickness Has shown that he can be disrupted offensively when guarded by taller more athletic players Defensively his lack of explosiveness and wingspan doesn't allow him to be much of a shot blocker Although he is an adequate post defender his average lateral quickness will hurt his perimeter offense Still needs to develop his post footwork as he picks up travel violations from time to time Although he has shown a good array of moves with his back to the basket, he'll need to polish them to have the same success against the NBA elite He could stand to become more comfortable facing the basket The fact that he is a year older than most in his class has led some to suggest that he is close to his peak in development

[Da Raider]

translation: He's white so he's slow and can't jump.

[ADD]

Translation: He's a great COLLEGE player from a great program. So John Paxson will draft him :(

[Rover]

IMO, I think he'll be a decent player, but not a superstar player given how tough PFs are in the NBA and I don't think he exhibits that type of defensive intensity most PFs in the NBA possess. as of now, he doesn't project to be a lottery pick, and some scouts have compared his game to wait for it ... Eduardo Najera and Mark Madsen. now I cannot think he'll be a player like those two, but his lack of size for the 4 position in addition to lack of athleticism to play against NBA PFs will hurt his draft value. having said all that, I thought Kevin Love wouldn't be a top 10 pick (having some of the same flaws against him), but he ended up getting picked high, so it's too early to tell.That's basically the way I see it. He had this half breakaway dunk in a game the other night where I thought he was going to get blocked by the rim. But when he goes on the low post he's got that half hook shot of his that could go in every time, but then when I think about the dozens of weak side defenders in the NBA that could block that shot every time he tries it.

I just don't know about him in the NBA. He should try to get an NCAA exemption to play college ball his entire life because I love his college game, but I don't know if he'll be athletic enough at the next level.

[Pollo]

I just don't know about him in the NBA. He should try to get an NCAA exemption to play college ball his entire life because I love his college game, but I don't know if he'll be athletic enough at the next level.

he'll be an OK player, but it will shock me (and hell scouts) if he turns out better than we think given his lack of athleticism but most importantly his lack of size -- NBA PFs will eat him alive all game long, especially if he plays out West. looking back before he started his UNC career, you can arguably say Sean May was better defensively, and look how his career in the NBA has fared so far. the championship foursome of Marvin Williams (chosen before :gulp: Deron Williams and Chris Paul), Felton, May, and McCants are nothing more than mediocre NBA players.

[GhettoSuave]

Tennessee has played like they're competing with the football team on suckiness.

[UNC]

UNC 93, MSU 58 right now. Anyone watch this blowout?

[ADD]

Nope. Why bother? MSU sucks the cock of life.

[Tar Heel]

I didn't think we'd kill them like that. Generally, the #12 team in the country doesn't get blown out by 36 to anyone.

[heelsguy]

unc will be even better when ginyard comes back.

this team is a product of players staying longer than they could have. it's almost like a 1980's NCAA team..one that not just has ONE future NBA player, but SEVERAL. reminds me of UNLV in 1990. deep.

[ninja33]

I didn't think we'd kill them like that. Generally, the #12 team in the country doesn't get blown out by 36 to anyone.

Michigan State had no business being ranked 12th in the country to begin with, let alone after getting blown out by maryland. i wasnt too surprised by the blowout, but still pretty impressive for unc.

[mongo]

just finished watching the indiana/gonzaga game a bit ago, and fuck, i hate gonzaga, but they look legit. the amount of offensive weapons is insane. pargo is a fucking beast (fuck him for backing out of his uw commit). the line on the zags/uconn game is going to be crazy.

[ADD]

unc will be even better when ginyard comes back.

this team is a product of players staying longer than they could have. it's almost like a 1980's NCAA team..one that not just has ONE future NBA player, but SEVERAL. reminds me of UNLV in 1990. deep.

But will any of them be good NBA players?

[Poop Sailboat]

michigan beat duke? wtf!

[ADD]

Michigan beats ranked teams. They beat UCLA as well.

[Poop Sailboat]

i figured ucla was just a fluke. but dook?

[ADD]

Duke is a fluke. Pretty much every year.

[Rover]

Barring a total collapse, Michigan should make the NCAA tournament for the first time in a decade. Beating the #4 team in the country twice should be good for some bonus points somewhere. Also, going 1-2 in the ACC isn't bad. Hell, 3/4ths of the the ACC won't beat Duke once.

[Smuckers]

Barring a total collapse, Michigan should make the NCAA tournament for the first time in a decade. Beating the #4 team in the country twice should be good for some bonus points somewhere. Also, going 1-2 in the ACC isn't bad. Hell, 3/4ths of the the ACC won't beat Duke once.

I agree. Michigan beating two top 5 teams is not a fluke. I am a fan of the Big Ten, hopefully they will do well in the tournament if they continue on with their play.

[heelsguy]

duke is not a fluke. top teams usually stumble once before conference play starts. duke may not lose again until hansbrough completes the 4-0 career sweep at cameron indoor, his leased low-rent apt.

[Smuckers]

I think Hansbrough & Co. will most likely go undefeated and cruise to the title barring a major injury. I don't think they're invincible, and a team might sneak in a win (I think Wake Forest), but right now, they just look a step better than the other top 10 teams, although Gonzaga is outstanding.

[Pollo]

I agree. Michigan beating two top 5 teams is not a fluke. I am a fan of the Big Ten, hopefully they will do well in the tournament if they continue on with their play.

woah ... I was thinking you would of said the Big East because of your beloved Fighting Irish.

[Smuckers]

woah ... I was thinking you would of said the Big East because of your beloved Fighting Irish.

haha. I actully just enjoyed Clausen for some reason this year, but he disappointed me as the season went on, I guess I want to see him succeed.

But as for basketball, I like seeing the B10 do well since I live just 30 mins away from University of Illinois and have been up there a lot. I think Illinois can sneak in the tournament, same with PSU, Michigan, Minnesota and Purdue. Im not really partial to any particular team in the country for basketball, although I enjoy watching Duke lose, and UNC, UCLA and Gonzaga are fun to watch. But not really a big fan of anyone, which makes it better, because unlike another *Certain* sport, basketball is very slow (since theres fouls alot), there's lots of parity across the country and since it's so slow and mometum changing, it is nerve racking for fans, so I'm not sure if I could stomach watching live games if I was a die hard fan of a certain team.

[Penguin Rick]

Northwestern is getting into the tourney at least one of the four years I'm here.

It has been written, now let it be done.

[Smuckers]

I can see them sneaking in. They've also got really nice seats in their arena! I love those cushiony seats.

[ADD]

Unbanned? FUCK

[Rover]

Northwestern is getting into the tourney at least one of the four years I'm here.

It has been written, now let it be done.Not without some recruiting violations.

[nuclearjew]

Damn, Noles just beat the Gators. Gators looked pretty sloppy out there.

Someone had a sign "TEBOW CAN'T SAVE YOU NOW". Hah.

[mongo]

http://i42.tinypic.com/6t3crt.png

[Gary_Busey]

We lost to NCState tonight. I fucking hate NCState.

[UNC]

Tyler breaks Phils record (http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/basketball/recap?gid=200812180413&prov=ap)

Carolina pwns....everyone here should bow down

[Stax]

Uuuuuuuuuuuuuccccoooooooooonnnnnnn.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/columns/story?columnist=katz_andy&id=3776778

[heelsguy]

I guess tyler deserves it. but phil did it while passing first and shooting second...had no 3 pt shot, and was forced to run the Four Corners in many games instead of shooting. take phil's points + assists and compare that to hansbrough's same and see what i mean. not only was phil #1 in points when he graduated, he was # in assists too. (that record stood until I beleive cota broke it? and ALL he did was pass.)

that does not mean tyler is not good, but he is not even in my top 10 of unc players all-time. hell, if marvin willians or stackhouse or carter or jamison or jordan or worthy had played all 4 years....jesus. just imagine

[Smuckers]

Tyler is fun to watch. UNC looks pretty good but didn't have their best game vs. Rutgers last night. But they still won. I really like Gonzaga and Wake Forest, too.

Anyone following NJIT? I check their site after each game to see if they win, but no. They went 0-29 last year and are 0-12 this year (i think)...hope they can win a game. I wonder how you recruit for NJIT.

[Stax]

And Blech, UConn looked horrible vs. GTown tonight. Georgetown played at a high enough level I'd be ok with losing that game, but it wasn't even close. Constant turnovers, Thabeet once again forgot how to score, yech.

[UNC]

I hope Illinois beats Michigan. I like the underdog....and both of these teams prolly qualify as that but Illinois seems to be the more unlikey winner..

[The Dude]

i really hope bc upsets the tar heels...oh, wait...

[ADD]

I hope Illinois beats Michigan. I like the underdog....and both of these teams prolly qualify as that but Illinois seems to be the more unlikey winner..

i really hope bc upsets the tar heels...oh, wait...

Damn you both to hell

[nuclearjew]

W00t! Things are looking up for the Beavs.
Oregon State stuns Southern Cal in OT

CORVALLIS, Ore. (AP)—Roeland Schaftenaar’s 3-pointer sent the game into overtime and Oregon State went on to beat Southern Cal 62-58 on Sunday, snapping a 23-game Pacific-10 Conference losing streak.

Schaftenaar tied a career-high with 18 points for the Beavers (6-6, 1-1), who erased a 15-point second-half deficit. Calvin Haynes added 16 points, including four points in overtime.

Taj Gibson led Southern Cal (10-4, 1-1) with 15 points. The Trojans entered the game on a five-game winning streak and had beaten the Beavers seven consecutive times.

Oregon State’s conference losing streak dated back to a 73-65 home win against Washington on Feb. 22, 2007. The Beavers are in their first season under coach Craig Robinson, the brother-in-law of President-elect Barack Obama.

[mongo]

i really hope bc upsets the tar heels...oh, wait...

i really hope harvard upset bc...oh, wait...


the golden eagles suck more pole than sasha grey.


lulz, first time harvard has EVER beat a ranked team.


and they beat them by 12. wow.

[Smuckers]

hahaha @ Boston College. But you could see it coming from miles away...but wasn't expecting it to be from Harvard.

I think Clemson may be a dark horse this year. Illinois, too.

The Big Ten is a impressive conference this year...I am impressed with lots of teams.

I look for West Virginia to make a splash this year.

UNC and Duke may share the ACC title. But neither will win the ACC tournament.

I am very excited for UNC @ Wake Forest - I think UNC may win but Wake is strong.

UNC needs to up its defense to win the title. Hansbrough, Green and Ellington have been getting better but Bobby Frasor needs to find his shooting touch.

Overall this will be a exciting year of basketball.

[ninja33]

when is it not an exciting year of basketball?

[heelsguy]

wake forest is quickly no longer becoming the "switzerland of the ACC". fucking getting on my nerves. unc 0-2 in the ACC...fuck

oh well, thank god this is not BCS managed....win 6 straight games in late March and you will be champs

[Smuckers]

I watched OU last night and Blake Griffen is great. Hope he stays in school and doesn't go to the NBA so I can watch him for two more years.

[Smuckers]

I hope UNC can sneak past their troubles. I had a feeling Wake forest would beat them but im not sure whats going on. I think Bobby Frasor needs to find his shooting touch. He's not very accurate. I love Tyler Hansbrough...but he seems like hes not having fun...I am anxious to see if Roy can get the chemsitry back. When he screamed at the players in a timeout late in the wake forest game you could tell something was missing. I am not a UNC fan (im not a basketball fan of anyone, very neutral) but I enjoy watching unc play. I think Clemson or Duke will win the regular season title, but if UNC can sneak in wins they might share it with them.

I know I just said it, but Blake Griffen is really good, I hope he stays in school...love watching him (hes cute too)

Wow...Indiana is no good this year...im watching them on TV ... what happened to them? Hope Tom can turn it around so the Big Ten can do well.

[mongo]

texas a&m is looking legit as hell.

14-2 (soon to be 15-2 as soon as they pull out of baylor's ass) and the big guys on that team can fucking battle down low.

how the fuck are they not ranked?

[hoponator]

Nope. Why bother? MSU sucks the cock of life.


Not true. MSU is rolling right now.

[UNC]

Wake Forrest will be the new number one...I wish we played them again...maybe in the tourney.

Ellington looked sexy last night

[heelsguy]

Wake Forrest will be the new number one...I wish we played them again...maybe in the tourney.

Ellington looked sexy last night


as usual, UNC wins if/when they play hard defense for 40 minutes. I said it in Jan 08 and I am saying it again.

ellington did, (23 in the 2nd half) but he still needs to play like a man all the time...too passive for me. almost just as bad to be scoreless in the first half..he needs to attack the basket more

[nuclearjew]

Interesting Esquire interview/article on Craig Robinson, OSU's basketball coach (and brother-in-law to Barack Obama):
Craig Robinson: America's First Coach

Michelle Obama's brother once used a game of hoops to vet her boyfriend Barack. Now a head coach, he's using basketball to see whether a bunch of kids who went 6-25 last season have any, well, hope.

By Chuck Klosterman

It's 5:55 A.M. in the Pacific Northwest. I'm watching an extremely well connected bald man yell at an extremely bad basketball team. The well connected man is a Princeton graduate; seven days from this morning, he will also be the brother-in-law of the president-elect of the United States of America. His bad basketball team is nicknamed the Beavers and went 0-18 in the Pac-10 last year; if they manage to go 9-9 this season, the president's bald brother-in-law will deserve to be named coach of the year. I'm watching him conduct practice from the upper deck of Gill Coliseum in Corvallis, Oregon, and I'm trying to figure out if I am supposed to be writing a story about politics or a story about basketball.

The tall bald man stands at midcourt and watches his squad run through the reverse phase of its half-court offense. It's repetitive and draconian. The bald man is sarcastic but not playful. He accuses his players of being con artists and makes them run penalty sprints. Whenever he addresses anyone on the roster, he refers to him only by jersey number. He tells a point guard to "sit the fuck down," because said point guard is "demoralizing practice." When a small forward cuts to the wrong space on the floor and grows confused, the bald man asks, "So you're dumb enough to run over there, but you're too dumb to go back to where you came from?"

One of the better players keeps offering excuses as to why he made the same mistake two times in a row. This is the wrong diplomatic tack. "If I hadn't made you run so much already," the bald man responds, "I'd make you run more, because you are too stupid to shut your fucking mouth. We all love you here. We love guys who can make shots. But shut your fucking mouth!"

The Beavers begin work on their full-court man-to-man defense. Due to their physical limitations — they don't have any reliable low-post scorers — one assumes the Oregon State Beavers will spend most of 2009 trying to dictate the tempo. But today's attempts at ninety-four-foot pressure never seem to gel, and it's (evidently) all one kid's doing.

"You're the only one who doesn't seem to understand what we're doing here, number five." The bald man isn't yelling anymore, but you can tell he's frustrated. "We aren't trying to trap anybody. This isn't a trap. You really don't seem to understand the philosophy of what we're doing here, number five. And you're supposed to be one of the smart ones."

I keep watching the Beavers run the floor and shoot the rock, and I try to figure out what I can learn about who they are as humans from the way they play basketball. I'm doing this for two reasons. The first is that this is always part of the experience of watching sports. If you believe that basketball is important (and I like to believe that it is), then that importance is inevitably symbolic. Sports are theoretical reflections of life, art, and society. But my second motive is more specific. The tall bald man I have been observing — Craig Robinson, the first-year hoop coach at OSU — has relentlessly insisted that he can deduce everything he needs to know about a man's character by watching him play basketball. In fact, if you know only one thing about Mr. Robinson, it's undoubtedly this: When his then-twenty-five-year-old sister, Michelle Robinson, began dating a wiry law student named Barack Obama, she asked her older brother to play basketball with him. It was a test, and Obama passed. That pickup game in Chicago has become a key anecdote in the Obama narrative, just as the game of basketball has become central to Obama's iconography. (On an episode of HBO's Real Sports, Bryant Gumbel classified him as the "first hoopster in the White House.") It's a story people in the media love to retell, because it seems personal and metaphorical at the same time — it's an example of how we build myths that feel true. But as I watch the Beavers struggle against themselves, and when I talk to the reasonable man who coaches them, I find myself wondering just how much of that feeling is a way for us to pretend we understand things about strangers that no one can ever really know.

First, the overtold anecdote (overtold again): Two decades ago, Michelle tells Craig she's dating a new guy at her law firm whom she's relatively serious about, but she wants Craig to figure out if he's the real deal. Can this future lawyer be trusted? She tells her brother that her suitor self-identifies as a basketball player and asks if he can play with Robinson and his friends. The six-foot-six Robinson was a two-time Ivy League player of the year at Princeton and a fourth-round draft pick of the Philadelphia 76ers, so the competition level was relatively high. Robinson tells the rest of it like this:

"This story gets bastardized," he begins. "I tell every reporter the same story, using the same words, and then they write whatever they want. But here is what happened: When I played basketball with Barack, he was quietly confident, which means he had good self-esteem without being cocky. He was certainly a team player — he wasn't a pig, he passed when he was supposed to pass, and he cut when he was supposed to cut. To me, that speaks to a lack of selfishness. He had natural leadership ability, because he didn't just pass me the ball because he was dating my sister. Whenever a player gets tired, he reverts back to the player he truly is. That's how you tell. And we played for hours. That's how I could tell."

So there you go: The portrait of Obama the player is exactly like the portrait of Obama the president. The qualities he displays at the top of the key are the same as those he will employ in the Oval Office, and that makes us feel good, both about the man (who is now leader of the semifree world) and about the notion of basketball (thereby validating our collective obsession with a beautiful, frivolous street game). But something about this simplicity doesn't compute. Reality can't be that simple. I ask Robinson how much information can authentically be learned from four hours of recreational basketball.

"I think if you ask anyone who plays basketball seriously, they will echo what I am telling you right now," he says. "Just from working my own guys out, I can tell everything about each one of those players."

And here is where things start to get complex. Throughout the morning's practice, Robinson confronts a couple of his players with a special kind of intensity. He does not appear to be simply criticizing their style of play; it seems as if he's criticizing their entire worldview (which, according to the overtold story about the pickup game with Obama, is not an entirely unreasonable thing to do). Yet when I mention these seemingly meaningful exchanges, Robinson becomes defensive.

"No, no," he says. "You're only hearing the things I'm saying out loud. What you're missing is that my reason for saying those things [to that player] had nothing to do with his character. This morning I was coaching kids — I wasn't trying to figure out who my sister should marry. I was saying things to that player in order to motivate him to work on other aspects of his game. It would be different if I were telling the kid he was selfish, but I wasn't saying that."

I ask about a different situation with a different player: During their half-court scrimmage, one of the Beavers is knocked to the floor but refuses to take the hand of a teammate who tries to help him up. At the time, his failure to accept help outrages Robinson. Moreover, it seems like a perfect example of how you can read a person's personality from how he plays a game. But this suggestion also annoys Robinson.

"The reason I got upset is because that particular kid is a baby," he explains. "When he gets fouled, he lies on the floor. If someone on our team fouls an opponent, we're always going to help him up. That's the sporting thing to do. You pick him back up. The reason I got on that player is because he was being a baby. He didn't want to be helped. But you can't take that out of context. My relationship with my players is different than vetting my sister's boyfriend."

Now, my reason for pointing out these contradictions is not to trap Robinson with his own words; my reason for pointing them out is that Robinson is totally right about all of this. It's impossible for me to understand the nature of any Beaver basketball player from watching a single practice, or even from watching ten games during the regular season. Everything is contextual. But it's strange how we all want to overlook those amorphous contexts when the moral of a story is enchanting. There are important things we want to believe about who Barack Obama is, and it would be wonderful if those important things could be wholly validated by his willingness to set screens and move without the ball during one afternoon in 1989. But they can't. It's just a story we try to believe, because it takes something complicated and makes it obvious.

In an interview with ESPN, Robinson described Obama's floor game like this: Barack is a left-handed player who can only go to his left. He's got a long frame. He'd rather drive than shoot. He isn't much of a passer. From this cursory description, it sounds as if Obama is a politicized version of ex-St. John's scoring machine Walter Berry. But this comparison is inaccurate. According to Robinson, the player Obama most resembles is stoic, Nixon-era point guard Lenny Wilkens. Now, this might be true. His logic works. But I assume Robinson also felt an obligation to select a southpaw doppelgänger who represents a certain class of positive, nebulous value. Wilkens has been inducted into the Basketball Hall of Fame twice and has no negative baggage; conversely, nobody who understands basketball would want to think their president is like Walter Berry, an offensive black hole who once casually remarked, "My game does not consist of fundamentals." Such an allusion would not test well.

The delicacy (and the potential consequence) of this comparison epitomizes the complexity of Robinson's current life. Five years ago, he was the most famous member of his family. After dominating at Princeton (and getting cut by the 76ers), he played professionally overseas before going into finance and eventually becoming the head hoops coach at Brown. After only two seasons in the Ivy League, he was offered the job at Oregon State, a once-powerful program that has completely collapsed. ("I'm honestly still trying to sort out the forensics on what happened here," he admits. "It must be something so bad that no one wants to say anything about it.") In and of itself, this would be a challenge. But Robinson also carries the curious honor-burden of being related to the most high-profile couple in America. He has to deal with questions that John Wooden never had to consider.

"It is comical what I get asked about. Comical," Robinson says. "I was once asked what kind of refrigerator Michelle owns. Obviously, I have no idea what kind of refrigerator she owns. One that keeps food cold. . . . This campaign [was] more important than everything. I would be kidding myself if I thought my basketball season was more important than the election. So this was the first time in nine years that something was more important to me than basketball. But that's okay. Everybody understands that. What has affected me more is how many more people now know who I am. I have a newfound respect for people who are celebrities. I mean, Barack is really famous. When you're a basketball coach, you're a public figure — but not like this. When I was in training camp with the 76ers, I was around people [like Julius Erving and Moses Malone] who were famous. But nothing like the way Barack is famous. You can't even compare it. I've been around Michael Jordan, and Michael Jordan is about as famous as it gets. But that was nothing compared to this."

Robinson's sentiments are unsurprising. What relationship is comparable to knowing the president? What situation is comparable to being the principal footnote in a story that (partially and supposedly) explains who Barack Obama is? That pickup game in Chicago is now the most important basketball game Robinson has ever been involved with, and it probably always will be, even if the Beavers go to the Final Four. It was mostly a coincidence, but that's mostly what history is. Had Michelle not broken up with whatever random guy she dated before Obama, a lot of what we think we know about our current president might be more different than we'd like to imagine.

And who was that random guy, anyway?

"Wow. Nobody has ever asked me that," Robinson says. "I remember a couple of other guys she dated from Princeton, because we were both there at the same time. My sister was the type who would date a guy for a period of time, but if she didn't see a future, the guy was gone. Maybe there were some guys when she was in law school, but I was playing ball in England at the time. When she first got to Princeton, I was still there, and I think guys wouldn't date her just because they knew I was her brother. I think the last guy before Barack was a guy from Princeton, but I don't want to say his name in case I'm wrong. He was a very nice person, though. He has a nice family now. But he wasn't a basketball player. Barack is the only guy she asked me to play against."

And that matters. More than it should, but less than you think.

[ADD]

Michigan State sucks cock. That is all.

[UNC]

Cwemson was so cwute with thier wittle top ten wanking

[Smuckers]

congrats to NJIT - they finally won a game!! They beat Bryant by 10 points to snap a 51 game lose streak!

[ShitBreak]

Interesting Esquire interview/article on Craig Robinson, OSU's basketball coach (and brother-in-law to Barack Obama):

Speaking of him...he's gonna be on Rome today. So you might check it out.


When Rome first said yesterday that "Craig Robinson" was gonna be on, I was all like "Sweet, Darryl from the Office!"

[mbslugger89]

ncaa champion is obviously coming out of the acc, i just wish i had a clue which team it will be! unc, wake, duke, or clemson toss up between those 4 in my eyes

[kevin6387]

Clemson isn't in the picture, UNC still has the same defensive problems as last year. I think a Big East team will take it this year.

[nuclearjew]

I didn't know this backstory about Brandon Roy. Makes me respect the guy even more.

Washington retires Roy’s jersey
By GREGG BELL, AP Sports Writer Jan 22, 11:04 pm EST

SEATTLE (AP)—Six winters ago, Brandon Roy was ineligible and insecure, cleaning out containers in a shipyard.

Now, he’s cleaning up every major basketball honor in his path.

The latest came Thursday night, when the 2006 All-America and Pac-10 player of the year, the 2007 NBA rookie of the year, 2008 All-Star and Portland Trail Blazers dynamo came home to become the second player in the 107-season history of basketball at the University of Washington to have his Huskies jersey retired.

“I really can’t put this into words,” Roy said, moments after buying dozens of boxes of pizza for the Washington students lined up outside Hec Edmundson Pavilion.

The kids were queuing for prime court-side seats to see Roy’s UW jersey No. 3 go up into the remodeled arena’s rafters near the No. 25 of 1950s’ Huskies star Bob Houbregs immediately before the surging Huskies’ played Southern California. Roy chose the number at Washington to honor his older brother, who wore it as a high-school star before troubles derailed his chance at college.

Washington’s players honored Roy by wearing gray T-shirts with No. 3, his name and likeness on them over their uniforms while they warmed up for the game.

Then a beaming Roy walked to center court immediately before tipoff with his parents, his fiancee—who was holding their infant daughter—and Huskies coach Lorenzo Romar. Roy carried his young son in the crook of his right arm as the sellout crowd roared.

“One of two in 100 years of basketball (to get his number retired)? That’s amazing,” Roy said, wearing cuff links beneath his monogram at the ends of the open-collared, white dress shirt that complemented his dark suit. “Even more, the 30th Pac-10 player? It’s a great list to be on.”

An improbable one, too.

Roy failed to get qualifying college entrance scores out of Seattle’s Garfield High School in 2002. His scores improved so dramatically when he took the SAT a second time the disbelieving NCAA’s clearinghouse rejected them as invalid. So he took it again—and his scores were lost. Then they were found. The NCAA cleared him for eligibility. The UW did not, initially.

Months of what should have been his freshman year passed, darkly. The Huskies’ season began and Roy was a confused teenager, shut out of college and the arena in which he is now immortalized. He needed a purpose, a job.

So the man who torched the Phoenix Suns for 52 points earlier this season with the Trail Blazers scrubbed industrial spills out of the insides of shipping containers in the rugged, cold shipyards in downtown Seattle.

Talk about rags-to-riches. The payoff was three consecutive NCAA tournaments, Pac-10 royalty in his hometown and NBA stardom down Interstate 5.

“Yeah, the doubt definitely crept in my freshman year,” Roy said, chuckling. “I thought, ‘Man, I’ll never have that chance.”’

His family kept encouraging him, saying everyone’s story is different “and this one is yours.” Each day, his co-workers at the shipyard made sure Roy didn’t see the docks as a dead end.

“That taught me a lot, sitting with those guys. They would say, ‘When you get a chance to go to college, be successful,”’ Roy said. “Even now, when I’m playing and it gets real hard, we’re on the road and I want to be home, I can always think ‘This can get a lot worse.”’

Romar remembers as if it was yesterday the January day in 2003 he told Roy Washington had declared him eligible. They hugged and held on for what Roy said had to be five minutes.

“That was probably the most special day of my life,” Roy said.

He went directly to his first UW practice. In 45 minutes, the tall, slashing guard had figured out an offense his teammates hadn’t picked up in months.

He refused to redshirt because he was so eager to play. But for the next couple seasons, he quietly sat back and let teammate Nate Robinson, now with the New York Knicks, get the accolades as Washington soared into the nation’s elite. Washington needed Roy to rebound, so he led the Huskies in that.

Then Roy missed much of his junior season with a knee injury. He returned mainly as a sixth man, content to ease his way back in, to not disrupt the chemistry of a team that was on its way to another NCAA tournament.

He took over in his senior season, averaging 20.2 points and scoring the fourth-most points (666) in a UW season. He passed. He rebounded. He shut down opponents’ best scorers. The Huskies went 26-7 and reached another regional semifinal of the NCAA tournament before losing to second-ranked Connecticut in overtime.

“There’s not too many things he didn’t do,” said Romar, who also played at Washington in 1979-80. “You go back and check every year of every player who has ever put on a Husky uniform. None had the year Brandon Roy had.

“Brandon Roy separates himself from any era. You can’t match what he did. … Brandon’s in a class by himself.”

[mongo]

i want bilas to die a slow death.


also, marquette has 3 guards you're gonna see playing in the nba. remind me of the illinois team from a few years back. they are doing their damndest to beat the faggots from notre dame right now.

[mongo]

lulz, bilas just said "over penetrates". lulz.

[ADD]

Yay Wake!

Hope you enjoyed your time at #1, Duke

[heelsguy]

the refs tried to screw UNC by messing up the seconds remaining, but ty lawson got down the court and hit the game winning 3 anyway. ha ha ha


ACC >>>> Big East, (top to bottom)

[nuclearjew]

Beavs win the Civil War! (which is tantamount to winning the Apple Cup in football lately)

Beavs are 4-0 since Obama was inaugurated. w00t

[kevin6387]

KSU upset Texas today. That will hurt for their RPI. Also gives opponents a psychological factor knowing that KSU can go into Austin and beat UT.

Willie Warren and Blake Griffen are a force.

[Stax]

Stupid Ohio State beating Purdue, ruining my little Streak for the Cash streak.

[ADD]

Stupid Ohio State

What he said

[kevin6387]

UNC is now without Ginyard and Graves for the year. Goodbye any chances at a Championship with that thin backcourt and no defense.

[ADD]

Stranger things have happened

[kevin6387]

If they couldn't last year with those 2, the I doubt they will this year without those 2 and their stud freshmen (Zeller?).


They haven't looked like a championship team this year and their defense seems to be getting worse wtih every game I see. UConn is the most impressive team in the nation IMO.

[ADD]

Teams and competition change from year to year. Why even bother playing the tournament then?

[UNC]

Clemson is crushing Duke right now

[UNC]

Clemson 74, Duke 47.

teehee

[nuclearjew]

OMG THIS OSU/ASU GAME IS AWFUL. 41-29 with 6 mins left in the game.

[mongo]

so fans just stormed the court after missu beat kansas. what has the world fucking come to? i mean so number 19 beat number 15 AT HOME! fuck. stay in your fucking seats you stupid fucking 3rd tier students.

[Pollo]

hey Smuckers ... you think ND is a championship contender this year?

ND has had one hell of a brutal schedule and still have UConn, Louisville, Villanova, and West Virginia to play. they're a woeful 3-7 so far in the Big East.

[ninja33]

so fans just stormed the court after missu beat kansas. what has the world fucking come to? i mean so number 19 beat number 15 AT HOME! fuck. stay in your fucking seats you stupid fucking 3rd tier students.

They beat their biggest rival (who was undefeated in the conference) for the first time in about 3 or 4 years, erased a 15 point second half deficit and ended the game on an 11-2 run to win it on a shot with 1 second left. I know what youre saying because it wasn't a huge upset, but it was still exciting as hell for the crowd...i dont blame them at all.

[kevin6387]

They were favored by 4.5 points and won by 2 against KU who had 27 turnovers. It was an ugly game.

Rushing the court was Busch league... which is why I don't blame them at all. It pretty much sums up Missouri fans.

[mongo]

if florida fucking knew how to shoot freethrows, we'd still be in overtime. fuck the gatorz!

[heelsguy]

ok kiddies, time for THE college basketball rivalry. Duke hosting UNC tonight at 9

Tyler Hansbrough goes for 4 out of 4 at Cameron Indoor...if he gets it, he should have his name placed somewhere on the court...because he will forever be part-owner

UNC by 10

[heelsguy]

today is all about UNC and Duke. so anyone having a problem can go fuck themselves.. none of this big-ten or big east bullshit for this one day at least:


UNC wins advantage in recruiting wars

Talent has shifted its fortunes in rivalry with Duke

By Ken Tysiac
ktysiac@charlotteobserver.com
Posted: Wednesday, Feb. 11, 2009
http://media.charlotteobserver.com/smedia/2009/02/11/07/976-roy316.embedded.prod_affiliate.138.jpg
Coach Roy Williams' system has been consistent since he arrived at North Carolina.



The way Bob Gibbons sees it, North Carolina's superior recruiting results under Roy Williams are starting to show in the rivalry with Duke.



As the teams prepare to meet at 9p.m. today at Cameron Indoor Stadium, North Carolina owns five wins in the past seven meetings.
Seniors Tyler Hansbrough and Danny Green have a chance to become the first Tar Heels players to end their careers 4-0 at Cameron since Buzz Peterson in 1985. North Carolina has won the past two ACC titles and is 14-3 in the past four NCAA tournaments.
Duke is 5-4.
Gibbons thinks he knows why the No.3-ranked Tar Heels (21-2, 7-2) appear to have nudged ahead, even though No.6 Duke (20-3, 7-2) is tied for first place in the conference.
“Not that Duke has recruited badly, but North Carolina has sort of exceeded them in recruiting,” said Gibbons, the All-Star Sports recruiting analyst. “And the end result is the differential in the game performance.”
Twice in the past three years, North Carolina has landed a better recruiting class than Duke, according to scout.com's rankings. The Blue Devils had a better class in 2005, but Duke's gem in that class was center Josh McRoberts, who left after two seasons for the NBA draft.
North Carolina's best player in that class was Tyler Hansbrough, who's still around.
“You get the national player of the year over in Chapel Hill for three years running … and he stayed four years,” said Raycom Sports TV analyst Mike Gminski. “It was a little atypical in that they've had talent that has stayed. But I just think at least from the starting five and a little bit of depth, (North Carolina's) talent has been better.”
North Carolina's recent surge in the series has followed years of domination by Duke.
Before the current 2-5 swoon, the Blue Devils had won 15 of the past 17 in the rivalry. Positive or negative, Duke coach Mike Krzyzewski said he won't mention the historic numbers to his players.
“Kids can't identify with history,” he said. “They're too young.”
Because of the way Krzyzewski coaches, it makes sense that he would reject history. Although a high-pressure, man-to-man defense is his staple, he makes significant changes in strategy each season based on his personnel.
When the Blue Devils had high-scoring guard J.J. Redick, Krzyzewski designed his offense to get Redick tons of shots. The lack of a strong post presence last season led Krzyzewski to spread the floor in a freewheeling style, creating open 3-point shots and driving opportunities.
Krzyzewski said that each season he designs his offense to take advantage of the strengths of his best players. But he's still trying to figure out what this team does best.
In the meantime, Duke has built its identity around a defense whose switching on screens has prevented opponents from penetrating into the lane.
“Our defense and our rebounding, they're up a notch from last year, and that's why we've won,” Krzyzewski said. “But the offense has got to get better.”
Heels in high gear
Meanwhile, Williams' system has been consistent since he arrived at North Carolina.
Even when he didn't have the perfect personnel for his much-admired, fast-breaking offense in 2005-06, North Carolina ran. That way, the players were ready to reach a high gear when speedy point guard Ty Lawson arrived in 2006.
Like Krzyzewski, Williams is focused more on the moment than the history. He said that when Duke won last season at the Smith Center, he didn't feel like the Tar Heels had nudged past their rival.
But he said North Carolina's success overall is the result of hard work and good fortune.
“We've been very lucky in a couple recruiting scenarios that we've gotten kids who I thought were going to be big-time players and perhaps maybe even have done better than that,” Williams said. “I hope it doesn't go in cycles because I'd like to keep going straight ahead and not fall back.”
The coaches' systems might not be as important as the players running them. Dick Vitale, the Hall of Fame TV analyst who will work tonight's game for ESPN, said a point or two in a few recent games could have turned the results in Duke's favor.
But Vitale said North Carolina has superior talent.
“I don't think there's any question with Carolina, they've got the best starting five in the nation,” he said. “I think the two most gifted teams in the country are Connecticut and Carolina.”
In that respect, Duke's most significant losses over the past two seasons might have come in recruiting rather than on the court. Krzyzewski rarely misses on players Duke recruits as vigorously as Kentucky sophomore Patrick Patterson and Georgetown freshman Greg Monroe.
Either one could have given the Blue Devils the strong post presence they lack.
“(Monroe) makes great passes,” Gibbons said. “Patterson is more the physical rebounder that they need that they haven't had since (Shelden Williams). They haven't had an imposing space eater inside that can go and dominate on the boards.”
More of the same?
The alarming thing for Duke is that North Carolina's 2009 freshman class, like the 2006 class, is rated No.1 in the nation by scout.com after the early signing period.
Duke has signed two forwards who are possible McDonald's All-Americans in Ravenscroft High's Ryan Kelly and Mason Plumlee of the Christ School in Arden.
But North Carolina commitment John Henson of Tampa, Fla., is rated more highly than Kelly and Plumlee in the Tar Heels' deep class. Duke still has a shot at brilliant Word of God Academy senior point guard John Wall in the spring signing period, but Gibbons said the current recruiting results predict North Carolina will stay ahead of Duke.
“They've got five kids who are potential high school All-Americans,” Gibbons said. “So based on next year's incomers, again, North Carolina dominates.”

[kevin6387]

who's got a bigger hardon right now? Heelsguy or Dick Vitale?

[UNC]

The only team that can beat Carolina tonight is Carolina.

[kevin6387]

The only team that can beat Carolina tonight is Carolina.

that's true... their defense is so non-existent that all their losses are due to it.

[UNC]

who the fuck are you?

[UNC]

101-87

UNC pwns Duke @ Duke agAin

[heelsguy]

ok kiddies, time for THE college basketball rivalry. Duke hosting UNC tonight at 9

Tyler Hansbrough goes for 4 out of 4 at Cameron Indoor...if he gets it, he should have his name placed somewhere on the court...because he will forever be part-owner

UNC by 10

oops...we won by 14. my bad

go to hell, Duke.

[nuclearjew]

More like Thabeeast.

[Stax]

More like Thabeeast.

Speaking of whom, what a horrible fucking call to give Thabeet his 4th foul. He was WALKING DOWN THE COURT, boxed out Blair, and had a foul called.

UConn leads though. Fuck Pitt. The game is being played exactly the same in the 2nd half as in the first, yet magically a dozen calls go Pitt's way. Hasheem got freaking flipped OVER a guy, but touching another player with one arm to box out is a foul.

[UNC]

I hope Pitt wins

[ADD]

I hope they don't. Then we'll hear for a week how it took them 10 tries to knock off a 1.

[UNC]

Pitt taking charge

[Stax]

Pitt can suck a dick. Their guys inside can openly shove a guy back a couple feet but the lightest touch by UConn was (for some reason) a foul for about the first 8 minutes of the 2nd half.

[Stax]

I like Fields look there.

"What? I'm not allowed to lose control of the ball and my body and tackle Gavin Edwards? That's a foul?"

[mongo]

stax, in this thread, you're starting to sound like osumike.

[Stax]

stax, in this thread, you're starting to sound like osumike.

No need to go down to that level, mongo. All I know is Pitt flipping Hasheem Thabeet over their back and slammed him to the ground while UConn committed only 2 fouls in the whole first half, yet it was Pitt that got calls for some reason in the 2nd.

[mongo]

No need to go down to that level, mongo. All I know is Pitt flipping Hasheem Thabeet over their back and slammed him to the ground while UConn committed only 2 fouls in the whole first half, yet it was Pitt that got calls for some reason in the 2nd.

sorry. i lost control for a second there.

also, pitt didn't win that game, uconn lost it.

[Stax]

sorry. i lost control for a second there.

also, pitt didn't win that game, uconn lost it.

Blair beat the shit out of UConn. Both within the rules and against them.

[mongo]

i tend to disagree. uconn should have stayed inside their game. i mean fuck, thabeet plays 25 minutes and only 5 fg attempts? that's not uconn. at least not this years uconn.

[Stax]

i tend to disagree. uconn should have stayed inside their game. i mean fuck, thabeet plays 25 minutes and only 5 fg attempts? that's not uconn. at least not this years uconn.

When Thabeet gets invisible foul #3 at the start of the 2nd half and then box-out foul #4 like 10 seconds after coming back in with 3 it's tough to play solid minutes.

http://i40.tinypic.com/2rnbehj.jpg

Oh hai, R this foul?

[mongo]

When Thabeet gets invisible foul #3 at the start of the 2nd half and then box-out foul #4 like 10 seconds after coming back in with 3 it's tough to play solid minutes.

i'm not arguing that point. all i'm fucking saying is that when uconn can't run their o through him, they aren't playing their game. if he isn't taking 12-15 fga's per game, they will not fucking win. end of story. i'm not going to nit pick over fouls, all teams that get upset always think they get the shaft.

[Stax]

i'm not arguing that point. all i'm fucking saying is that when uconn can't run their o through him, they aren't playing their game. if he isn't taking 12-15 fga's per game, they will not fucking win. end of story. i'm not going to nit pick over fouls, all teams that get upset always think they get the shaft.

And I'm saying when you get tackled in the first half you are going to miss first half minutes, and when the refs remove you from the game in the 2nd you aren't going to get minutes. They weren't looking inside enough, sure, but UConn sucks hard at breaking inside sometimes.

[mongo]

stop blaming the refs. uconn.did.not.play.well!

[UNC]

I thought Mongo was too gay to see past uniform colors

[mongo]

my favorite schools wear purple!

[UNC]

nah...that was wesley snipes storming the court naked

[ninja33]

i'm not arguing that point. all i'm fucking saying is that when uconn can't run their o through him, they aren't playing their game. if he isn't taking 12-15 fga's per game, they will not fucking win. end of story. i'm not going to nit pick over fouls, all teams that get upset always think they get the shaft.

So youre saying that UConn should be 2-24 instead of 24-2? Because Thabeet has attempted 12+ field goals twice this season. He's reached double digits six times. Their offense does not rely on running through him. They lost tonight because their offense needed another scorer like the injured Dyson, but mostly because Pitt dominated inside (13 more rebounds, 16 offensive boards, 22 points for Blair) due to Thabeet's absence on the defensive end. He is not an offensive player, his 25 points against Seton Hall were an anamoly.

[mongo]

So youre saying that UConn should be 2-24 instead of 24-2? Because Thabeet has attempted 12+ field goals twice this season. He's reached double digits six times. Their offense does not rely on running through him. They lost tonight because their offense needed another scorer like the injured Dyson, but mostly because Pitt dominated inside (13 more rebounds, 16 offensive boards, 22 points for Blair) due to Thabeet's absence on the defensive end. He is not an offensive player, his 25 points against Seton Hall were an anamoly.

but his 5 points are sub-par for sure. and you have to remember, his offensive game is shots within 5 feet of the rim, dunks, and free throws. the ncaa does not count shots as FGA's when the shooter is fouled in the act of shooting.

Field Goal Attempt will be charged to a player every time he shoots, throws or taps a live ball at his opponent basket when he is attempting to score a goal (except when he is fouled in the act of shooting and the goal is not made.)so yes, i don't think 12-15 is abnormal for him at all.

also, the reason they didn't have any other scorers AND pitt looked so good inside tonight was due to the lack of thabeet. both touching the ball on the offensive end, and him sitting on the pine.


if he is playing as usual he does the following:

-blocks a shit ton of shots.
-keeps said blocks inbounds
-scores 10-12 per game
-gets to the line 4 or 5 times
-get the other team's big men to rack up fouls (kind of like pitt did to him tonight)
-draw a double team to help open up the perimeter. especially when playing against man2man d like pitt ran most of the night.

[Rover]

I didn't see the game, but if UCONN got screwed by the refs. Good. Their game against UM was filled with questionable calls by the refs. Thabeet got his share of calls against a way smaller Michigan team.

[Stax]

Mostly Jeff Adrien needs to learn how to play team basketball. It didn't happen much last night, but the number of times I've seen him in triple coverage say "Fuck it, I ain't kicking it out to AJ Price who's open for 3 or whatever, I'M GOIN' UP YEEHAW!" and completely airball pisses me off. The number of times he doesn't protect Thabeet defensively so Hasheem can't step an inch away from the basket for fear of never ending baseline attacks.

[ninja33]

Even if you want to include free throws to try and hit your arbitrary number of field goal attempts, Thabeet probably takes about 10 shots per game. I agree that he's the most important player on the floor for UConn, but thats due to his defensive presence. Yes it would have helped UConn a lot if he could have chipped in his usual 12 points last night on dunks, putbacks, close baskets, etc...but claiming that their offense needs to run through him is just wrong. You don't run an offense through a guy who can only score from within 5 feet of the basket, unless he's a very good passer. Thabeet has 13 assists this season.

[Da Raider]

Dear College Basketball,

I have a confession to make. You used to be my third favorite sport (NFL #1, NBA#2). My love for you was enormous. The history, the tradition, the athleticism, March Madness, etc. Alas, the quality of the game has gone down since they started allowing freshmen to enter the draft. No more following players from Freshman to Senior year. College Football and MMA have surpassed you in my eyes. I now only watch you from afar. Visit you during March Madness, but you've lost that loving feeling.

*sigh*

Sincerely,

I've moved on

[UNC]

Purdue is looking good early versus Missagain State

Dick Vitale can't even hardly talk...that sumbitch needs to retire like Packer...or just die already.

[UNC]

Purdue crushes Michigan State.

Clemson makes a joke out of Maryland...

I wanted a close game tonight!

Seton Hall teased me during the first half...but it looks like Marquette is about to leave them in the dust.

[UNC]

Zeller is coming back for the Tarheels.

Much needed depth down low.

Tastes like chicken

[UNC]

Wow...hard to keep up with the conversation, but I'll try.

Illinois, wtf....beaten by Penn st. That was an ugly game.

Heels beat NCSU again...Virginia beats VaT....

Zeller played 8 minutes, scored a bucket and looked as rusty as he should be.

[ninja33]

Penn St. is a decent team, i'm not too surprised they beat Illinois. But only 33 points for illinois? yikes.

[heelsguy]

roy williams let fly an f-bomb. (http://blogs.newsobserver.com/multi/roy-williams-lets-f-bomb-slip)

love it

[mongo]

uw and ucla are trading the lead back and forth in l.a. right now. fuck the bruins.


also, uw wins this and at usc on saturday and they'll be top 15. sexy.

[kevin6387]

uw and ucla are trading the lead back and forth in l.a. right now. fuck the bruins.


also, uw wins this and at usc on saturday and they'll be top 15. sexy.

I hope Washington wins the Pac-10 just to beef up KU's RPI.

[mongo]

well, it looks like they are gonna lose tonight. down by 5 w/ 2 minutes to go. fuck.

[nuclearjew]

Beavs spanked the shit outta Stanford last night. They might cause a little damage in the Pac-10 tourney this year! Roeland Schaftenaar is a beast. And the Ducks are trying to tie our 0-18 conference record that we set last year. Why can't they ever let the Beavs do anything solo? First we win the College WS and they have to get a baseball team, and now this? I bet the Ducks will win at their house on 3/1 though. I may make the drive down for that one (but probably not, I'm lazy and broke).

[heelsguy]

fucking Greivis Vasquez ....more like Darth Grievous

UNC allows yet another guard to score 30 pts+ on them. In each our 3 losses to BC, Wake and now MD, the Heels were late getting out on the hot perimeter shooters when those teams quickly reversed the ball. I know Roy is fed up with it. That was one of the aspects of this years' team which precipitated that F-bomb he dropped wed. night.

Maryland simply wanted it more in the last 3 minutes of regulation and then OT. Roy will hopefully use this first loss in 11 games to wake up his team defensively..we'll see.

[UNC]

I don't even wanna think about this game for a couple of days

[heelsguy]

I don't even wanna think about this game for a couple of days


UNC has got to iron-out some issues they have defensively, and how could hansbrough only score 11?

UNC does better in the NCAA tourney when they have lost a game toward the end of the reg season, or even in the acc tourney (like in 2005). to carry what would have been a 14 game winning streak into the ACC tourney and then have to win 6 straight in march? that would mean a 23 game streak.

and yes, I am partially just rationalizing a road conference loss

[Penguin Rick]

I want to see how high Memphis gets ranked this week. They were #5 in the AP and had 3 of the teams in front of them lose this week, so I could see them at #3 behind Pitt and UConn.

[jemeske]

Um. Yeah. That would seem to make sense.


Duke-Wake is finally becoming a good game. Lead down from 20+ to single digits.

[Pollo]

I want to see how high Memphis gets ranked this week. They were #5 in the AP and had 3 of the teams in front of them lose this week, so I could see them at #3 behind Pitt and UConn.

pretty unreal how the two teams from last year's title game are doing this year. I figured they would take a step back for losing the talent they had, but I think Kansas has been very impressive, especially going 11-1 in the Big 12 thus far. they have a fairly good shot at beating Oklahoma Monday night if Griffin is out.

[ShitBreak]

Someone needs to find a video of Blake Griffen blowing chow all over the bench from the OU/Texas game. Man, he didn't know where the fuck he was the rest of the game.

I was really hoping OU would win that game too. Means the OSU/Texas game is a must win now.

[Penguin Rick]

Um. Yeah. That would seem to make sense.


Duke-Wake is finally becoming a good game. Lead down from 20+ to single digits.
Well, they are still #5 in the AP poll. Interesting... I think it's because everyone knows this Memphis team is no where near the level that last year's team was. And they are unwilling to give them a #1 seed, since besides last year, they haven't really lived up to a #1 team in the tournament.

[mongo]

Well, they are still #5 in the AP poll. Interesting... I think it's because everyone knows this Memphis team is no where near the level that last year's team was. And they are unwilling to give them a #1 seed, since besides last year, they haven't really lived up to a #1 team in the tournament.

uconn lost to the current #1, thus you knew they were only gonna fall a spot or two. happens all the time when two teams in the top three play each other. oklahoma barely lost to a ranked team w/out their star. how far did you expect them to fall, #10? no. as far as unc being ahead of memphis, i dont get it. just compare the rpi of their losses. fuck.

unc losses:
maryland - 53
wake forest - rpi 17
boston college - rpi 56

memphis losses:
syracuse - rpi 19
georgetown - rpi 44
xavier - rpi 13

the only varience i can think of that would justify the heels being ahead of memphis is the lack of depth in cusa. then again, the fucking acc is not deep this year either.

i think memphis should be at #4 and unc should be in the #6 range. however, i have no problem w/ pitt, uconn, and oklahoma being ahead of memphis. they all have only 2 losses, and all of their losses are either to fucking tough teams or w/out their star player.

[ShitBreak]

If OSU beats Colorado, Kansas State, and Texas....they have a good chance to be the shittiest team to make the Big Dance.

[mongo]

they won't.

fuck, they won't make the nit.

[ShitBreak]

Show me why they wouldn't even make the NIT? They have a top 35 RPI and a top 15 SOS. If they win 3 of their last 4, then win 20 games.

[mongo]

they will not win 3 of their last 4.

[ShitBreak]

Well they'll beat Colorado, which leaves winning two out of: Texas at home, Kansas State at home, and at Oklahoma

They can beat Kansas State. So that just leaves them beating Texas in Stillwater, or OU in Norman.

Texas seems the most do-able. Although it'll be tough.

[mongo]

you are such a fucking homer it's sad. they will lose to oklahoma by a shit ton. they will lose to texas by a shit ton. kansas st. is about as good as osu. that's a total crapshoot.

[ShitBreak]

No shit I'm a homer, retard. It's my alma mater. I try to think they have a shot in every game. If they didn't, it'd be pointless to play them.

[kevin6387]

you are such a fucking homer it's sad. they will lose to oklahoma by a shit ton. they will lose to texas by a shit ton. kansas st. is about as good as osu. that's a total crapshoot.

You're overrating Texas. They lost to KSU and Mizzou at home, and almost blew a 12 point lead to a Griffen-less OU squad. Granted Willie Warren is quite possibly the best freshman in the country, but UT is overrated and doesn't have a good PG to handle the ball.

[mongo]

^you're overrating osu.


also, this louisville offense is fucking ridiculous against gtown tonight. have yet to miss a field goal in the first half. they are over 10 minutes in. fuck me.

[heelsguy]

uconn lost to the current #1, thus you knew they were only gonna fall a spot or two. happens all the time when two teams in the top three play each other. oklahoma barely lost to a ranked team w/out their star. how far did you expect them to fall, #10? no. as far as unc being ahead of memphis, i dont get it. just compare the rpi of their losses. fuck.

unc losses:
maryland - 53
wake forest - rpi 17
boston college - rpi 56

memphis losses:
syracuse - rpi 19
georgetown - rpi 44
xavier - rpi 13

the only varience i can think of that would justify the heels being ahead of memphis is the lack of depth in cusa. then again, the fucking acc is not deep this year either.

i think memphis should be at #4 and unc should be in the #6 range. however, i have no problem w/ pitt, uconn, and oklahoma being ahead of memphis. they all have only 2 losses, and all of their losses are either to fucking tough teams or w/out their star player.


it's not all about RPI of the losses. How about the RPI of wins? let's just look at the notable ROAD wins:

UNC: won at duke, won at Mich st. , won at Notre Dame, won at Miami, won at FSU..

plus, the voters know that is basically the same UNC team that made it to the final 4 last year + 4 recruits + fraser - marcus ginyard

[mongo]

i would argue w/ you, but i already did argue w/ osumike today. i can't handle two homers in one day. i will give you a quick rebuttle though.

in short, miami and notre dame suck. they are not good wins. memphis beat gonzaga and tennessee on the road. both unc and memphis have a shitty sos. they are pretty evenly matched as far as the numbers go(rpi against, quality of wins, etc...). it's a shame that voters, if what you say is true, still think about last year. this team from unc is obviously worse than last year.

[UNC]

Memphis is 1-2 against ranked teams and has not even played a team in the top ten

[UNC]

Carolina is 4-1 against ranked teams...3 of which were in the top ten

[UNC]

I'll agree that they are no better than last year at this point...and if they don't get better defensively...they will fall short of Detroit

[mongo]

it's not about where they were when you played them. it's about where they are now. christ, notre dame and gtown were top ten at one point. now wins against them ain't shit.

[UNC]

Yeah...glad you mentioned that...Georgetown beat Memphis

[mongo]

and bc beat unc. what's your point?

[UNC]

Carolina has played 5 of the current top 25....memphis has played just 1

Your point?

[mongo]

memphis didn't lose this past week. unc did. memphis should be #4, not the exact same rank they were last week.

[UNC]

and bc beat unc. what's your point?

My point was that Georgetown was one of the 3 ranked teams that Memphis has played...So was Syracuse and both of them have fallen from grace and suck...but still managed to beat Memphis.

[UNC]

memphis didn't lose this past week. unc did. memphis should be #4, not the exact same rank they were last week.


Yes...well I guess quality wins over UTEP and SMU should be given more merit.

[mongo]

maryland and boston college were never "in grace" to begin w/.

also, if oklahoma loses tonight, i think they lose their #1 tourny seed.

[mongo]

Yes...well I guess quality wins over UTEP and SMU should be given more merit.

you must be forgetting about your boys playing penn, nevada, and uc santa barbara. not to mention, the acc is a little soft this year.

[UNC]

Memphis has not been tested at all. Gonzaga is the ONLY team they have played that's even a borderline top 4 seed. Why would you even think of taking up the argument that they should be ranked higher than 5?

You are completely out of your element in this thread.

[mongo]

so you think that unc losing to maryland and dropping one spot and memphis winning all it's games this past week and not moving up at all when 3 of the teams above them lost is how it should be?

[UNC]

you must be forgetting about your boys playing penn, nevada, and uc santa barbara. not to mention, the acc is a little soft this year.

omfg...you're talking about december tune ups...I'm talking now

http://i452.photobucket.com/albums/qq249/mrgr8shagxxx/Untitled-4.jpg

The truth.com, bitch

[mongo]

if shit in december is just tune-ups, then memphis should be king. when was the last time they lost? oh yeah, and they play defense.

[UNC]

so you think that unc losing to maryland and dropping one spot and memphis winning all it's games this past week and not moving up at all when 3 of the teams above them lost is how it should be?

I think that there is a vast seperation between 4 and 5...and I am not alone in this. Sure we lost to maryland...but Maryland is a rival and is a nationally respected program...that we should have beat...but it's not beyond belief that we could lose there...we have lost there alot in the past 10 years

[UNC]

if shit in december is just tune-ups, then memphis should be king. when was the last time they lost? oh yeah, and they play defense.

All season is tune ups for memphis is my point.

I see how Arch feels most times in the philo threads now.

[mongo]

i think we need more opinions from people not in carolina.

[nuclearjew]

I think that there is a vast seperation between 4 and 5...and I am not alone in this. Sure we lost to maryland...but Maryland is a rival and is a nationally respected program...that we should have beat...but it's not beyond belief that we could lose there...we have lost there alot in the past 10 years
Pretty sure that Georgetown, Syracuse and Xavier also fit this description.

[UNC]

Yes...and all 3 beat Memphis

[UNC]

Where are the quality wins for Memphis?

Gonzaga?

lol

[nuclearjew]

But your point was that Maryland beat UNC and wasn't a shitty team. Neither were Memphis' three losses.