New Shuttle Delayed Till 2014

[Kilgore]

NASA Delays Next-Generation Space Shuttle Program Till 2014


The space agency cites funding concerns for the four-year gap, as the Discovery, Atlantis, and Endeavor shuttles are expected to retire in 2010.

NASA's next space shuttle won't launch until 2014, a year later than managers of the space agency initially hoped.

NASA announced a revised budget and schedule because of funding and technical concerns. The Discovery, Atlantis, and Endeavor shuttles are expected to retire in 2010, after 10 more missions.

Astronauts will launch into space aboard new Orion capsules, powered by Ares I and Ares V rockets. They were officially scheduled for flight by March 2015, but NASA managers hoped to beat that deadline by two years.

"Since the program's inception, NASA has been working an aggressive plan to achieve flight capability before our March 2015 target," Rick Gilbrech, associate administrator for the Exploration Systems Mission Directorate, said in an announcement. "We are still confident the Constellation Program will make its first flight to the International Space Station on or before that date. Our new path forward better aligns our project schedules with our existing funds to ensure we can address the unplanned challenges that always arise when developing a complex flight system."
The announcement of changes in plans for the Constellation (http://www.nasa.gov/constellation) Program came the same day the Aerospace Safety Advisory Panel (http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/oer/asap/index.html) released its 2007 annual report, which stated concerns about funding for the Constellation Program. "While there are still opportunities for improvement, the panel's finding concluded that NASA is making significant progress in improving safety issues during the past year," explained Joseph W. Dyer, advisory panel chairman. "The ASAP commends the Constellation Program for endorsing the recommendation of the ASAP and continuing to employ early hazard and risk analysis."
http://www.informationweek.com/news/hardware/supercomputers/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=210002783

Lame

[Malone]

That sucks. No launches for four years now.

[Claydon]

This is rather annoying but typical of any new project of this size.

Oh and the title is misleading, NASA is not building a new shuttle.

[Robert Paulson]

So we stay out of space for four fucking years. Wow.

[Claydon]

So we stay out of space for four fucking years. Wow.

It is a bit of annoyance as we will have to pay the russians for transportation to the ISS. Nasa/congress loves to cancel systems that are operational in the hopes of something new in the future look at the Apollo systems. They could just reduce the fleet to 1 shuttle and keep flying them once per year for ISS needs.

[Robert Paulson]

I do understand that the shuttles are in need of retirement but sitting for 4 years without going up would be a mistake IMO. Can't they just funnel a bit of money at one orbiter and do a bit of refurb.

On a side note I hear that the Airforce muesam down the street from me is slated to get an orbiter for permanant display in 2010 so I have mixed emotions about my above comment.

[Claydon]

I do understand that the shuttles are in need of retirement but sitting for 4 years without going up would be a mistake IMO. Can't they just funnel a bit of money at one orbiter and do a bit of refurb.

On a side note I hear that the Airforce muesam down the street from me is slated to get an orbiter for permanant display in 2010 so I have mixed emotions about my above comment.

I believe this is a real mistake for nasa and the congress to pull this bullshit. Here is a novel concept, free up 3 billion a year from Iraq and funnel it into nasa to keep 1 shuttle flying. Besides arab terrorists im not sure what our money is getting us over there except for a corrupt friendly arab government as opposed to a unfriendly government.

[HAWK]

All of the BS that went into the Cold War as far as our fears of the Russians beating us in the space race....and here we are about to hitch a ride with them into outer space.

[Robert Paulson]

I'd vote to bomb them if I didn't love their salad dressing soo much.

[Trident]

Jesus, you guys are going to have to get over the decline of the US dominance in space. It's for the better that commercial companies and other nations take over the routine stuff, leaving NASA to do what it does best: exploration.

[Robert Paulson]

Yes I agree but HOW THE FUCK DO WE EXPLORE WITH NOTHING TO SHOOT OFF?

[Will-Kill]

Now someone else gets to own space.

[Claydon]

Jesus, you guys are going to have to get over the decline of the US dominance in space. It's for the better that commercial companies and other nations take over the routine stuff, leaving NASA to do what it does best: exploration.

We are in decline? Really? Clearly you have no concept how awsome this new platform will be, it will service ISS and be a vehicle for lunar missions. The chinese are basically doing what we and the russians did back in the 60s and the chinese basically copied the russian capsule design (slow clap).

[Trident]

Yes I agree but HOW THE FUCK DO WE EXPLORE WITH NOTHING TO SHOOT OFF?

You've got your existing launch vehicles (Delta and Titan rockets) for probes and shit, the ESA are considering developing a human launch capability for the Ariane 5 and the Soyuz system will do fine until Orion comes on line.

As much as I love the Shuttle (and I do) it's costing a shit-load per launch and is not economical for you, let other nations take the strain for the routine operations.

[Trident]

We are in decline? Really? Clearly you have no concept how awsome this new platform will be, it will service ISS and be a vehicle for lunar missions. The chinese are basically doing what we and the russians did back in the 60s and the chinese basically copied the russian capsule design (slow clap).

Jesus, read what I said. It's GOOD that the world won't have to rely on the US Government and NASA for simply getting in to space. I know Orion will be very good, but that's got a long-term specific purpose (Moon and beyond). Even NASA are pleased about the private ventures and commitments from other Governments.

[Feng]

It is looking more and more like we'll be buying our real-estate on the moon from the Chinese afterall...

[cyclops]

this sucks!

[Archetype]

Hey, Mars, it's just sitting there, do something about that.

[Mulder]

Not with the new shuttle they won't! I personally still can't understand how a shuttle looking like this can do anything other than floating away!

[wlack]

why not just build another couple of shuttles - but this time make it with proper computers and bits that don't fall off ...

[Claydon]

why not just build another couple of shuttles - but this time make it with proper computers and bits that don't fall off ...

douche...

shuttle fleet was completely upgraded about 8 years ago...glass cockpits the works. Why not build another...well because they cost around 3 billion each, and the shuttle can only do low earth orbits, max altitude of 300 miles or so, constellation is intended to go to the moon.

[Mulder]

Claydon that's some nice scientific definition. I totally agree!

[Whiffleball]

I'm all for science and exploration as the next guy, but there's so much we should be doing here on Earth that we're not. We should be tackling socialized medicine, eliminating poverty, improving education and investing in our industries first and foremost. When we have a surplus again, then we can turn to the stars.

I wouldn't be too worried about the Russians or the Chinese. The Russian space program was always fueled by duct tape and vodka and it's not like they're going to experience a huge windfall where they're going to be colonizing Mars before we do. And the Chinese should consider bringing their entire country out of the 19th century before they try to emulate Star Trek.

[Claydon]

I'm all for science and exploration as the next guy, but there's so much we should be doing here on Earth that we're not. We should be tackling socialized medicine, eliminating poverty, improving education and investing in our industries first and foremost. When we have a surplus again, then we can turn to the stars.

I wouldn't be too worried about the Russians or the Chinese. The Russian space program was always fueled by duct tape and vodka and it's not like they're going to experience a huge windfall where they're going to be colonizing Mars before we do. And the Chinese should consider bringing their entire country out of the 19th century before they try to emulate Star Trek.

to quote spanky

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c145/idexx/picard-headesk.jpg

tackling socialized medicine? why so we can severely lower the quality of care and wharehouse people in substandard facilities and pay 50% in taxes and adding another 2 trillion per year in spending. Wonderful... why not spend 15-16 billion a year, get some fantastic science done and have an agency that has improved biomedical research by leaps and bounds since the 1950s rather than giving that money to the 'poor' who will use it to buy MD2020 . I trust tax dollars more with academics and scientists more than some GED grad now USDA clerk processing food stamp applications.

[Whiffleball]

Spanky didn't come up with the facepalm thing. That meme was started shortly after Al Gore invented the Internet. (http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/Facepalm)

I'd rather not derail this thread into a debate over universal health care. The fact is that the U.S. is the only wealthy, industrialized nation that does not have a universal health care system. And it makes sense to have one. Should fire houses only put out fires at houses who pay insurance? Even if the fire spreads to non-insured houses and razes the whole neighborhood? Should we have mercenaries instead of police and soldiers, who only protect us from fear when we can pay? Having a healthy society is in the interests of everyone and the public good should trump private greed.

Even if you take socialized medicine out of my post, the point is that we have a lot of problems here on Earth where money is sorely needed. We could be making real social progress if we got our budget priorities straight. And I happen to believe moon rocks and cells on Mars should fall behind helping the disadvantaged here in our own country and creating a more equal society.

[Claydon]

Spanky didn't come up with the facepalm thing. That meme was started shortly after Al Gore invented the Internet. (http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/Facepalm)

Even if you take socialized medicine out of my post, the point is that we have a lot of problems here on Earth where money is sorely needed. We could be making real social progress if we got our budget priorities straight. And I happen to believe moon rocks and cells on Mars should fall behind helping the disadvantaged here in our own country and creating a more equal society.

ok...so what is 16 billion a year going to do with these so called problems? 16 billion <<<<<<< 2 trillion.

Seems like our society is fairly equal, blacks are in some of the highest position of power both economically and politically. Many many so called minorities are in the same boat. Hispanics and black middle class is growing every day, women can vote, minorities can vote, and the list goes on. So how will 16 billion create a more egalitarian society? Now if you want to get rid of the so called corporate welfare ie 20 billion to oil companies to subsidize exploration then yes, I would agree with you on that. You know, I have always paid for my own health care without too much difficulty, I live within my means, I don't go to the fucking ER when i have the sniffles and I stick with generic drugs. Somehow we don't seem to have people just laying in the streets dead like the 19th century. Yet, France had thousands and thousands die in socialized nursing homes and hospitals from lack of A/C a couple years ago. I guess those government budgets didn't cover that little issue.

[Whiffleball]

16 billion still isn't pocket change. Even if you consider it to be a small amount, you could still put it forward to programs that have a positive effect here on Earth than on missions to Mars or the moon. For education, we could put that money to hiring more teachers, making classrooms smaller, getting better equipment for our schools, etc.

A more equal society? Really? Then how come the Congress is almost entirely made up of old white men? How many minorities are running the most profitable companies in the country? Why is Obama becoming our next president so historic if it's so common to have minorities in positions of power? I don't equate having a more equal society than we did 50 years ago to mean that we've undone almost two hundred years of prejudice and discrimination.

I don't see how one incident of people dying in France because of a lack of A/C has to do with socialized medicine. As for the sniffles, in Canada they are implementing a system where people with more serious health problems will get faster access than those who don't. And if you can live within your means and get health care, bully for you. Doesn't change the fact that there are thousands of Americans who can't afford it and don't get it as a result, despite us being the most wealthy and advanced country in the world.

[Claydon]

16 billion still isn't pocket change. Even if you consider it to be a small amount, you could still put it forward to programs that have a positive effect here on Earth than on missions to Mars or the moon. For education, we could put that money to hiring more teachers, making classrooms smaller, getting better equipment for our schools, etc.

Want to increase the funds available for schools, abolish teachers unions who get unbelievable gobs of money from teachers and the education bureaucracy in general. Space programs provides tons of benefits for society. Best example that comes to mind is the software developed for hubble to find open clusters and globular cluster is very useful for scanning mammograms for precancerous lesions.

A more equal society? Really? Then how come the Congress is almost entirely made up of old white men? How many minorities are running the most profitable companies in the country? Why is Obama becoming our next president so historic if it's so common to have minorities in positions of power? I don't equate having a more equal society than we did 50 years ago to mean that we've undone almost two hundred years of prejudice and discrimination.

This country lost 750,000 citizens, and entire cites were razed due to the issue of slavery (amongst other problems of the early 19th century). Segregation was ended 50+ years ago, and ever since then minorities economic and political power has grown. This generation should not have to bow down and cry for the sins of past generations...this isnt europe. Why are so many white people in congress? Probably because caucasians represent the majority of this country ergo the majority of those in congress have less pigment in their epidermis.

I don't see how one incident of people dying in France because of a lack of A/C has to do with socialized medicine. As for the sniffles, in Canada they are implementing a system where people with more serious health problems will get faster access than those who don't. And if you can live within your means and get health care, bully for you. Doesn't change the fact that there are thousands of Americans who can't afford it and don't get it as a result, despite us being the most wealthy and advanced country in the world.

Lack of a/c in french hospitals was a decision only a government dipshit would come up with plain and simple. Our government can barely issue a passport let alone decide if it is ideal to have the necessary equipment to operate a hospital. Need I bring up the chronic festering problems of the VA which gets its funding and answers to the laws written by the congress. This same congress is the morons you would want to write the checks and laws for a socialized system. So canada has decided to triage patients? WOW, color me impressed, modern medicine has been doing that for last 150 years.

[Feng]

Uhh, Claydon... Space exploration is a waste of money. We're still burning fossil fuels to putter around our landscape at very slow speeds with totally inefficient technology. And you think it's time to boldly go where no man has gone before.

These guys are right, we still have to grow up, get a little more civilized and smarter before we can go venturing off into the vast empty void of space, which is 99.999999% nothing. Seems exciting, I know.

Besides, ping pong is very hard to play in zero g...

In another 1000 years if we are still around, we may be ready to explore space...

[Claydon]

Uhh, Claydon... Space exploration is a waste of money. We're still burning fossil fuels to putter around our landscape at very slow speeds with totally inefficient technology. And you think it's time to boldly go where no man has gone before.

These guys are right, we still have to grow up, get a little more civilized and smarter before we can go venturing off into the vast empty void of space, which is 99.999999% nothing. Seems exciting, I know.

Besides, ping pong is very hard to play in zero g...

In another 1000 years if we are still around, we may be ready to explore space...

Thankfully, you and the rest of your slow minded minions do not control institutions. We burn fossil fuels because they are cheap, abundant, and easily transported in liquid form for mass consumption. We drive inefficient vehicles in the US because US automakers are dipshits, americans suck down whatever marketing is thrown at them. Europe and Japan seem to have efficient vehicles Besides...do you like the internets, long distance phone calls, international air travel, weather sats? Say nothing of materials sciences, plastics...thank the space programs.

[Whiffleball]

Want to increase the funds available for schools, abolish teachers unions who get unbelievable gobs of money from teachers and the education bureaucracy in general. Space programs provides tons of benefits for society. Best example that comes to mind is the software developed for hubble to find open clusters and globular cluster is very useful for scanning mammograms for precancerous lesions.

Unions help teachers by providing them representation that fights for their rights. To eliminate any union is to step backward into the Victorian age when workers were being exploited to satisfy employers. My parents are teachers and they never complain about the union that looks out for them; they complain about government cutting their funding in budget after budget.

Why not cut out the middle and just invest in greater medical research? Why have space exploration if these bioscience byproducts are what you are really after?


This country lost 750,000 citizens, and entire cites were razed due to the issue of slavery (amongst other problems of the early 19th century). Segregation was ended 50+ years ago, and ever since then minorities economic and political power has grown. This generation should not have to bow down and cry for the sins of past generations...this isnt europe. Why are so many white people in congress? Probably because caucasians represent the majority of this country ergo the majority of those in congress have less pigment in their epidermis.


Again, I don't equate progress with meaning we have crossed the finish line. You're mention all these horrendous problems we had with race relations and then dismiss them as being solved in a few decades. Look at what happened with Jeremiah Wright. An entire generation of still-living African-Americans are so disillusioned and distrustful of the government they attack it with outrageous hyperbole. This isn't my grandfather punching someone else's grandfather in the nose and me having to pay for it. This is our entire society repressing entire groups of people for the vast majority of our history, specifically designing systems to keep them down and to protect the white establishment.

African Americans currently make up about 13% of the US population, but have historically been underrepresented in Congress. Currently 42 members (9.5%) of the House are black, while Obama is the only black guy in the Senate. Only three African-Americans have been in the Senate in the modern era.

Lack of a/c in french hospitals was a decision only a government dipshit would come up with plain and simple. Our government can barely issue a passport let alone decide if it is ideal to have the necessary equipment to operate a hospital. Need I bring up the chronic festering problems of the VA which gets its funding and answers to the laws written by the congress. This same congress is the morons you would want to write the checks and laws for a socialized system. So canada has decided to triage patients? WOW, color me impressed, modern medicine has been doing that for last 150 years.

I don't think the government has a monopoly on bad decisions. Look at how the Blackwater agents were sent on a suicide mission. Look at how many safety defects and how cost cutting costs people their lives. The government is actually designed to consider the public welfare while corporations are only out for high-as-possible profits. Again, you're using one incident you somehow dismiss the unreleated universal health care system.

I am Canadian doctors have been triaging patients for a long time but they're actually implementing measures (a conservative Prime Minister no less) to make sure that wait times are less of an issue than they used to be.

[Claydon]

Wow...just wow.

So, should we say the same about people who say 9/11 was a government conspiracy? Clearly obama was very lost as well as he attended that bigoted son of a bitch's church for 20 years.

[Hoser]

Thankfully, you and the rest of your slow minded minions do not control institutions. We burn fossil fuels because they are cheap, abundant, and easily transported in liquid form for mass consumption. We drive inefficient vehicles in the US because US automakers are dipshits, americans suck down whatever marketing is thrown at them. Europe and Japan seem to have efficient vehicles Besides...do you like the internets, long distance phone calls, international air travel, weather sats? Say nothing of materials sciences, plastics...thank the space programs.

No, Europeans and Japaneses do not drive efficient vehicles. They are more efficient then ours (we are getting closer but still have some work to do). But the internal combustion engine is anything but efficient.

I could go on about alot of the bullshit you have spewed but I would rather eat some chicken fingers and watch the Olympics.

Yes I know the space program is useful for some things. But finding water on Mars isn't going to help me get to my meeting at work any faster or watch TV any more clearly.

[Claydon]

Yes I know the space program is useful for some things. But finding water on Mars isn't going to help me get to my meeting at work any faster or watch TV any more clearly.

Neither is researching the behavior of spiders in the new mexico desert, but we pay for it, because it is science, and ads to the overall tome of human knowledge. We probably should not have researched a means of extracting oil from the oil sands of alberta.........i mean...fuck...then canada's government wouldn't be getting billions per year to pay for things like an 18 month wait for a hip replacement.

[Feng]

You won't find a cure for cancer by sending cameras out in to space...

[Archangel]

Yes I know the space program is useful for some things. But finding water on Mars isn't going to help me get to my meeting at work any faster or watch TV any more clearly.

I'm pretty sure that the average Spanish peasant said the exact same thing about Columbus's little trip.

When the fuck did accountants become more important than explorers? I blame the French. And that fag Rousseau.

[wlack]

The human condition requires that we look over the next hill just to see what is there. Spend more on exploration and help expand our universe - if the knuckle draggers and mouth breathers don't get it - don't worry they are breeding themselves into oblivion....